The American Legion Post 146 Legion Family Newsletter 1617 Mission Ave. Oceanside, CA 92058 Phone (760) 754-9633 FAX (760) 433-1046 Vol. XXVI, No. 8, February 2015 Website: www.legionpost146.org Change Service Requested NON-PROFIT ORG. U.S. POSTAGE OCEANSIDE, CA PERMIT 207 “For God and Country” “Sound Off!” Next meeting 0900 (9am) February 21st, 2015 POST POT: At the January 17th meeting Joseph Cacciola’s name was drawn. Joseph was not present at the meeting to win the Post Pot of $40. The Post Pot for February 21st, 2015 meeting will be $50; you must be present to win. Please note new mailing Address: 1617 Mission Ave; Oceanside, CA 92058. The P.O. Box is now closed. February Birthdays 1 Claude M. Robinson 5 Roy Sanchez 9 Leo J. Dezzutto 11 Jennifer Tommervik 14 Nathan Forrest 17 Hershell V. Barton 19 Bryon E. Inderrieden 23 R. Thomas Barnes 26 John C. Bahr 2 Anthony Cina 7 Victor L. Bothmann 9 Bernard Jackson 12 John A. Polansky 15 Robert W. Borgman 18 George R. Knisley 20 Frank X. Kullmann 23 Robert Sutliff 26 Casey Borst 5 Paul Tapia 8 Louis Poulopoulos 9 William H. Findon 12 Gary E. Billingsley 16 Raymond E. Arnold 19 Carlos Buenrostro 20 Bruce D. Canonico 24 Ron Rodgers 28 Nadean M. Swoboda 5 Harold L. Bronson 8 Al Henkel 10 Ray J. Page 14 James E. Waters 17 Frederick Cutler 19 Larry Schmidt 22 Juan A. Villasenor 25 David J. Bringhurst 28 Timothy Hall American Legion Post 146 Officers Commander James Greer 760-612-7125 Rev.JamesGreer59@gmail.com 1st Vice Commander Samuel H. Brookins III 760-390-6710 shb46@cox.net 2nd Vice Commander Vacant Judge Advocate/ Service Off. Charles T. Atkinson 760-941-4712 catkinson9@gmail.com Sgt.-At-Arms 760-473-6156 caronj7@cox.net Adjutant/Finance Off./Editor Edd Robinson 760-433-1165 robinson68@cox.net Chaplain Jack W. Moreno 760-855-7996 Amlegpost146info@aol.com Historian Vacant 3 Yr. Executive Committee Ken Derr 760-272-5941 capndirt1@cox.net 2 Yr. Executive Committee L. Ray Tate 760-433-1962 1 Yr. Executive Committee Mitchell P. Morgan 760-433-1965 Jr. Past Commander George A. Simons 760-310-6461 Rudolph (Rudy) J. Caron simonsg365@gmail.com Postal Compliance Notice: “Sound Off!” Is published monthly. It is the official newsletter of American Legion Post 146 Family, an incorporated nonprofit organization. Issue number & date are on the front page. Distribution is to the members of the Post, Riders, Auxiliary & SAL’s VIA e-mail or on the Web Site. Direct all inquiries concerning this publication to the “Sound Off’s” Editor at: 1617 Mission Ave.; Oceanside, CA 920518 or robinson68@cox.net. Anyone wishing to add articles to Sound Off! Will need to have them in to the editor no later than 6pm on the 3rd Sunday of the month, for the following month’s edition, in word format Please. Sound Off Via E-Mail or Website This newsletter is available Via E-Mail or on our Website www.legionpost146.org. We will be E-mailing it to any member who wishes to receive it. If you wish to receive Sound Off via E-mail call the post or better yet E-mail the adjutant robinson68@cox.net and tell him your E-mail address. The newsletter is also available at our Website www.legionpost146.org. This service will be FREE to all Post Members who wish to use it. Snail Mail is still available. You need to notify the Adjutant to add you to the list. Meetings Post 146 meets every third Saturday of the month in our Post home in the VANC building, 1617 Mission Ave. in Oceanside. Meetings start at 0900. Please park in the back of the building. For Post 146 information go to our Web page at www.legionpost146.org. The Post 146 phone number is (760) 754-9633, FAX (760) 433-1046. Volunteers needed to transport members who cannot drive to meetings. District 22 meets @ 0900 on February 8, 2015 @ Post 731 Linda Vista, CA. Come early for their Great Breakfast. Get involved with Post 146 www.legionpost146.org & District 22, www.LegionSD.org. From Post 146 Commander As we move through the rest of the year there are events approaching that need your 100% support. Law & Order dinner in March and the barbeque / chili cook off time to be determined. Also thoughts and efforts are being put in place for the Harbor Days event. This will also take entire support of every legionnaire. Please note that the Adjutant has closed the P.O. Box and all mail should be addressed to American Legion Post 146; 1617 Mission Ave.; Oceanside, CA 92058. For GOD, Country, and Community. Thanks for all you do. Commander James Greer *Money for Nothing* At the Post 146 meeting on October 18 during Good of the Legion, Mike Knudson mentioned that he had found several hundred dollars for himself and members of his family which California was holding in their unclaimed property database at https://ucpi.sco.ca.gov/UCP/Default.aspx. I searched that database on Wednesday and was surprised to find 7 unclaimed properties for my wife, son, daughter-in-law, and son-in-law for a grand total of $450.29. Unfortunately my name did not come up. However, I did achieve hero of the month status - thanks Mike! I suggest each member search the similar database that exists for each state that you lived in. Good hunting! David Kauppinen 1st Vice Commander Recycling continues to bring money into the budget. On the Commanders last run to the recycle yard he came back with $704 cash for the general fund. So you can see we are making it work & your help is needed to continue this Great hidden source of income. Please continue to support when you can & let’s work together to make 2015 our biggest year yet. Bring your bottles and cans to the new building at 1617 Mission Ave. & be sure to let them know they are for the Post 146 recycle program. Call me or the Commander if you have things for us to pick up. Remember the Adjutant is recycling printer ink, & cell phones. Please bring all you have to the next meeting. Samuel H. Brookins III, 1st Vice Commander, 760-966-1587 , shb46@cox.net Finance report: as of December 31st, 2014 we started off the month of December with $3,566.27. Income for the month was $1,507.70. Expenses for the month were $1,596.66. This left us an ending balance of $3,566.27. Membership report: We currently have 425 members paid & transferred to Department for 78.29% of our 2015 goal of 543. We would like to welcome the following new member Randy K. Brown, USA, Vietnam. Welcome! July was the start of our 2015 membership year. Dues have gone up to $45 for 2015. If you are currently on Active duty or a member of the National Guard the dues is $35. If you are currently a member of the U.S. military or National Guard you must send your $35 dues directly into Post 146’s P.O. Box. Include a copy of your current I.D. card & we will give you $10 credit for your current service and your payment of $35 as paid in full for the 2015 calendar year. Everyone else please send in or pay on-line your $45 dues as soon as you can. Please do not forget you can pay your dues on line if you wish at http://www.legion.org/renew. If you wish to become a Paid up for Life member Please contact the American Legion National. National is having a Paid Up For Life (PUFL) membership drive. To sign up go to: http://www.legion.org/join/pufl. Please be sure to send a copy of the confirmation letter to your Post for their records. American Legion Auxiliary Unit 146 Officers for 2014/2015 year President: Kim Crone 1975kcdc@gmail.com 760-415-8126 Secretary: Mani Santos Treasurer: Carolyn Byers mani7@cox.net carolyn57.cb@gmail.com 760-809-7204 760-945-4590 Chaplain: Aleta Whitehead 760-729-4514 1st Vice: Sandie Pines sandrapines@icloud.com 760-967-0952 2nd Vice: Marvel Simmons simmons_t2m@hotmail.com 507-402-0687 Sgt at Arms: Dodie Leaf dlgrama28@gmail.com 760-505-5648 Historian: Cory Santos Marshall: Roberta Mattice: csantos1@live.ndm.edu buggs417@aol.com Executive Committee: Tammy Nielsen tsn1962@sbcglobal.net District 22 Treasurer: Mary Thorsten 73andsunny@cox.net 760-421-1512 Jr. Past President Sandie Pines sandrapines@icloud.com 760-967-0952 American Legion Auxiliary Oceanside Unit 146 is starting the new year with many activities on our calendar. Come join us for BUNCO on Saturday January 31 from 1-3. We will be having fun & raising money for our VA&R program. This money benefits our current & retired military as well as their families. Then stay for dinner with the Vietnam Veteran’s of America Chapter 1031. They will be breaking in our new VANC kitchen with a spaghetti dinner that evening. YUMMY!!! The VA& R program also helps us continue to make a difference at the VA Hospital in La Jolla. Please mark your calendar for Saturday February 14, Valentine’s Day. It is American Legion Day at the La Jolla VA Hospital. We will be joining the Legion Family, Post, Riders & Auxiliary for activities that include assisting with BINGO, handing out valentines, serving lunch & donating much appreciated canteen books for the patients. These can be used to buy items at the hospital store. Please contact Kim Crone or Sandie Pines if you are interested in going. Oceanside Unit 146 will be marking our Presidents birthdays by donating “Presidential Rulers” to our adopted schools along with playing a coin game. More info & dates will be sent out so you may join in the fun!! Mary Thorsten has been busy organizing an Auxiliary Initiation Tea for February 28, 2015. This ceremony is a lovely way to be recognized in the auxiliary with visiting Department officers & join your fellow members to share a spot of tea. Want to learn more about the auxiliary? District Leadership Chairman, Lois Cornish will be giving a Leadership workshop at our February meeting. This is something members have been requesting & we are lucky to have Lois join us on our meeting day. Please mark your calendars to attend this important workshop on February 21, from 9 until 11am. I hope to see you at our next General Meeting Saturday February 21, 9am at VANC building. Be well & take care of yourself & your loved ones during this flu season. Respectfully submitted, Kim Crone, ALA President VA Clinic of Oceanside is looking for a FEW good Volunteers! If interested please go to http://www.sandiego.va.gov/ scroll done on the left side you will see in the gray box Volunteer or Donate Click on that and scroll down until you find Requirements to Volunteer: Everything is now online for your convenience and time…. Questions contact Mary Thorsten, 73andsunny@cox.net American Legion Riders Chapter 146 Officer for 2014/2015 year. President: Ken Derr “Tumbleweed” capndirt1@cox.net 760-272-5941 Vice President: David Noland ALR146east@cpx.net 760-757-8875 Treasurer: Tammy Nielsen tsn1962@sbcglobal.net 760-505-2873 Chaplain: Jacques Chevrier “Frenchy” frenchyandre@yahoo.com 760-519-9051 cpotterpi@cox.net 760-415-6650 Road Captain : James Lansberry Secretary: Brenda Gallo Historian: Vacant Sgt at Arms Chuck Potter “Chuck” Visit us on the web at http://www.legionpost146.org/riders_main.html The Riders had a busy month in January. 1-13 The Riders had their first Social Hour at the Junkyard Grill. Ten riders showed up and we had 3 visitors. Drawing will take place on FLAG DAY June 14, 2013 Tickets are $1.00 each or 6 for $5.00 1-17 Brenda and I rode to Post 434Quilt in Chula Vista 434's made by for theChapter ladies of theBurger Burn. American Legion Auxiliary Unit 146 Oceanside To get your WINand Randy Brown. After Arnold. And signed up three new members, Ken CHANCE Gardiner, AltoGreen Contact : our meeting 14 Riders rode to Post 149 for Burgers & Brats. Mary Thorsten 73andsunny@cox.net Frenchie continues his work with Vets Without Families. 760-421-1512 The Quilt will be at VANC on Memorial Day ! Our next social hour is Feb 10 and our next meeting will be on Feb. 28 1-24 Riders monthly meeting. We swore in two new members, Russ Nemeth and Raymond Respectfully submitted, Kenneth Derr, President ALR 146 The American Legion Riders are members of the American Legion who are also motorcycle enthusiasts. They can be found participating in parades, motorcycling events, and supporting the communities in which they live, work, and play. They also provide help, aid, and comfort to any current or former service member and their families. Members of the ALR come from the Legion, the Legion Auxiliary, and the Sons of the American Legion. The American Legion Riders are not a motorcycle club (M/C), and does not practice M/C rules or regulations. We claim no territory nor do we support or oppose any M/C. The American Legion Riders are family-oriented, just as is its parent organization: the American Legion. Our Mission: Veterans helping Veterans. Oceanside ALR 146 meets at 0900 every 4th Saturday at the VANC Building, located at VANC Building, 1617 Mission Avenue, Oceanside, CA 92054. ALR Chapter 146 Riding Events Our "Riding Events" include the following: Independence Day Parade, Oceanside Veterans Day Parade, San Diego Memorial Day Escort at Rosecrans National Cemetery Memorial Day Escort at Riverside National Cemetery Ride to the Wall, Washington D.C. Toys for Tots, Oceanside Patriot Guard Escorts Veterans Without Families Active Duty Arrivals Active Duty Departures KIA Memorials Veteran Memorials Annual Christmas Party Sons of The American Legion, Squadron 146 We now have 5 members in the SON’s. We need 5 more to sign up before we can submit our charter. Post 146 is now accepting applications for its Sons of the American Legion, Squadron 146. Also a leader is needed. Membership Eligibility: All male descendants, adopted sons and stepsons of members of The American Legion, and such male descendants of veterans male or female who died in service during World War I, World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnam War, Lebanon, Grenada, Panama, the Persian Gulf War, Iraq, Afghanistan, and the War on Terrorism, during delimiting periods set forth in Article IV, Section 1, of the National Constitution of The American Legion, or who died subsequent to their honorable discharge from such service, shall be eligible for membership in the Sons of the American Legion. We need 10 members to submit the Squadron’s Charter. We currently have 5 members. Please sign up today. Dues: shall be for General membership those over age 21, $20. Dual (Post and Son’s) membership $10. Membership for persons up to 21 years of age will be $10. Interested Please contact the Post 146 Adjutant for an application. (760) 433-1165 e-mail: robinson68@cox.net. Special Offer for Coffee lovers from BIANCA’S BISTRO I will donate 30% of profits from sales generated using promo code ALP146 to Post 146. Below are the links to my website. http://www.biancasbistro.com/how-we-give-back.html or http://shop.biancasbistro.com/ Their moto is: Making the world a better place, one cup at a time. Thank you, Bianca American Legion District 22 Training Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder/Suicide Prevention, Date: Saturday 28 February, Time: 2:30 p.m. to 4:30 p.m. (After the Leadership Training), 2:30 to 3:30 – PTSD Brief, 3:30 to 4:30 – Suicide Prevention Location: Post 731, 7245 Linda Vista Road, San Diego, CA 92111, Speakers PTSD; Karen Schoenfeld Smith, PHD, San Diego Veteran Center, VA, Suicide Prevention; Mr. Bob Parsons, Community Health Improvement Partners, QPR Institute. Help for those who may need it The American Legion has launched a new webpage listing recourses, warning signs & other information to help those confronting suicide. www.legion.org/suicideprevention Family Of a Vet Resources and assistance for service members, veterans & families with PTSD, TBI & the challenges of life after combat www.familyofavet.com Give an Hour Provides free mental health care to service members, veterans & families www.giveanhour.com Tragedy Assistance Program for Survivors (TAPS) Recourses & support for families who have lost service members in combat, training accidents, or to suicide or illness www.taps.org Not Alone Help for service members & families, particularly those dealing with PTSD www.notalone.org Her War, Her Choice Peer support for the families of service members, particularly those who deploy www.herwarherchoice.com Veterans Crisis Line www.veteranscrisisline.net, (800) 273-8255, press 1 National Center for PTSD www.ptsd.va.gov Law and Order: Like all the programs in the American Legion or any other worthwhile organization, teamwork and member support are essential ingredients for success. Over the years I have seen Post 146 pull itself up by the boot straps, but it only happened because the "membership" wanted it to become successful. Our Post Law and Order Program is 2nd to none. I have seen and been involved in several programs around the state, and Oceanside Post 146 is right up there. But to grow, or even maintain the high standards that you demand, it takes you, the Legionnaires, Auxiliary, and AL Riders support. To make that happen. If you take a look at the Emblem Sales catalog you will see the cost of medals, certificates etc., then consider the other costs of the program. The price of a dinner does not cover the cost of the program. In addition to purchasing a dinner, it takes your additional generosity through regular donations. Your contribution does not have to be a large amount, $5, $10, $20 or more helps the effort. If you donate, beyond the cost of your meal, your name will be published in this newsletter as well as listed as a Booster on the evening’s program. Our Chairman, Kevin Johnstone, continues to contribute a huge amount of time and effort to make your Law and Order program a success. You can be a big help with your donations. There is a Law and Order flyer in this newsletter with some particulars on donating. Your support is appreciated, the program cannot grow without your support, membership makes the program. Carl Asher, L/O Committeeman The American Legion Oceanside Post 146 P.O. Box 1085 Oceanside, CA 92051 Oceanside Elks Lodge 444 Country Club Lane Oceanside, CA 92054 ANNOUNCING THE 2015 LAW AND ORDER AWARDS DINNER Honoring Members of the California Highway Patrol, Oceanside Police Department, Oceanside Fire Department, Carlsbad Police Department, Carlsbad Fire Department, Carlsbad Lifeguards and the San Diego Sheriff’s Department Substation Vista and local citizens who have gone above and beyond the call of duty in the pursuit of Law and Order. 2015 OCEANSIDE & CARLSBAD LAW AND ORDER AWARDS CEREMONY & DINNER Thursday, May 14, 2015 Oceanside Elks Lodge 444 Country Club Lane Oceanside, CA 92054 5:30 PM 6:00 PM 6:45 PM 8:00 PM Cocktails Presentation of Colors, Welcome and Dinner Awards Program Photos Dinner tickets are $20.00 each. Your Support is appreciated! Donations Gladly Accepted. DEADLINE FOR RESERVATIONS: May 8, 2015. NO TICKETS WILL BE SOLD AT DOOR LIMITED SEATING! BUY YOUR TICKETS EARLY! If you are unable to attend, consider a donation to help cover the cost of the honoree’s family members. Register & Pay Online at: http://lawandorderawards-2015.eventbrite.com Or Mail Checks payable to “Oceanside American Legion Post 146” to Law and Order Program American Legion Post 146 1617 Mission Ave, Oceanside, CA 92058 (760) 801-9000 - kevinjohnstone@mac.com M Meeting Minutes 17 January 2015 1. Sign-in List correct mailing address on sign-in sheet 2. Call meeting to order 3. Roll Pledge of Allegiance (Stand) Ray Wilkerson 4. Chaplain – Charlene (Remain standing) 5. Introductions 6. Minutes From Last Meeting – (Corrections/Additions) Motion Joe Sellers, Second Joe Ashby, Passed 7. Finance Report – Brenda Bomar a. Building $1,035,859.67 for year. b. Balance as of Dec 31st $4,770.56 c. Savings $555,414.00 Motion Lynn Page, Second Chuck, Passed 8. Committee Reports – Honor Garden – Joe Ashby/ Juliet a. Garden Swings first Thursday of each month. b. First event tickets $10 in advance Scholarship – Picked up $105 to the Craftmanship Museum we now have over $500 in scholarship funds. We have $12,968 in bricks right now. We are selling recognition and it could be that special someone you have a hard time shopping for. Grants / Grant Writers Tom Gillen/Kathleen Clark CTAP – Sandra Continues to grow capping at 22 per class. We have waiting list for our classes. We are already excepting for our March class. Things are going really well, we are recruiting for coaches. Doing really well with placements. We are doing a lot of grant writing right now. Fundraiser Director – Leon Miller Last month Hot Rod breakfast received a check for $2000 in support of VANC. Meeting with Casino exec. VANC/ICS Meetings – John Meyer Community Service Meeting last meeting we had about 40 representatives. Team VANC – Joan Parro Web Site www.vancnorthcounty.org David, Around 1200 unique visitors a month. VANC Riders –Mike Schuster VANC Mgmt Workshop – Tom Gillian Moving from capital funding to programs. We are touring facilities to see what kinds of jobs are available for veterans. Looking at partnering with MiraCosta. Chuck - Building. Construction Put down the tile this week and are putting in the grout and the floor should be finalized on Monday. We will have a electricians in on Monday and they will be beginning the appliances in the Kitchen. The building should be done on the 27th. 9. Unfinished Business 10. New Business 11. Good of the Order – Armed Services Blood Drive www.militarydonor.com zip 92055 CP 619.729.0526 72nd anniversary of the Women Marines Association Saturday February 14 Pacific Views Event Center. 12. Schedule next meeting – 21 February, 2015 Oceanside VANC Building @ General meeting @ 10:30 AM. 13. Adjournment adVANC with Honor Veterans Association of North County (VANC) Newsletter, Joe Ashby, Editor, 760630-0740, jjashby@sbcglobal.net, Vol 3, No. 1 Jan 2015 Upcoming Meetings/Activities Mil Order of World Wars at VANC Jan24 Vietnam Vets Spagetti Dinner Jan 31 5pm Interfaith Meeting at VANC Feb 2 noon USMC Women Marine 72nd Anniv Feb 14 Team VANC Fri Feb 20, 10:30am VANC Monthly Sat Feb 21, 10:30am Head Shed, President Chuck Atkinson- What a year it’s been and what a year it’s going to be. We are in the final stages of completing the kitchen, the last part of your Veterans Resource Center. We are now moving from capital funding to the funding of VANC programs, things that really help our veteran community, especially those members of our Armed Forces needing to transition to civilian life. We are working with a number of organizations including Mira Costa College to develop and roll out training programs for vets. We are also setting up a Pro-Vet roster to recognize businesses that support veteran programs and hire our service members as they transition. Our matching funding with the City of Oceanside is nearly complete, all $600,000! We are anticipating the kitchen completion, cooking test and final inspection in January, and our 1st real test with the Vietnam Vets Assn. spaghetti dinner at 5pm on Jan 31st Veteran Services, Sandra Fichter- The CTAP program for this new year is already underway, and classes are full to the point that we are considering adding a 2nd roster of classes for Tue & Thur. Placements are still over 85% for our CTAP students and 95% find solid jobs within the first month. VANC Marketing, Director Leon Miller says we added $2,000 from a friend and his hot rod club, and the appeal is getting out to more and more businesses and organizations each day. He suggests we have a significant donor wall within the building to recognize those who have made the $ difference. Interfaith Services for Veterans, Director John Stryker Meyers- Interfaith is a coalition of resources providing direct help to our vets in the form of jobs, health & wellness, financial assistance and housing. About 40 different organizations met here this month and shared their direction in meeting veteran needs. They meet monthly at VANC on the 1st Monday at noon. VANC Scholarship, Joe Ashby- The Craftsmanship Museum of Carlsbad has already helped us raise nearly $700 toward our 2015 VANC Scholarship fund. We owe a big debt of gratitude to director Craig Libuse and his staff for displaying the Rolls a Rollin’ model and promoting VANC. There is still time for you and your organization to sell the $1 raffle tickets. The drawing will be Jan 31st. Tickets are available at VANC, or at the Craftsmanship Museum at 3190 Lionshead Ave. in Carlsbad. VANC. Our inaugural Garden Swing will be Feb 5th. Get your tickets soon as there is limited space and we will be selling out. $10 in advance, $12 at the door. Call VANC. Veteran Honor Garden Swings with Stefani Stevens VANC Honor Garden, Joe Ashby- We are in the final design stages of the VANC Honor Garden. The committee has worked hard, but the VANC Board wants the project design completed so we can set to work in getting the architectural plans and finding the funds to complete this important part of our VANC Resource Center. A complete vision of the Honor Garden will be presented in the near future. In the meantime, we need help from you or your organization to put in a few hours a month to mow, weed and care for our patch of land here at VANC. No special skill are necessary. Contact Joe Ashby at 760-630-0740. We also need you to help us promote the VANC Honor Bricks. They are an easy sell at $100 each, and provide a lasting legacy of whoever or whatever you designate. Just go to www.vancnorthcounty.org and buy a brick today! VANC Garden Swings- VANC is in the entertainment business with Garden Swings 6:30-9:30 the 1st Thursday of each month at Growing up in Long Island, N.Y, Stefani's biggest influences were the sounds of the early Jazz, Blues and Rock & Roll eras. Stefani trained with various Opera and Jazz artists such as Jazz Vocalists Kevyn Lettau and Martin Grusin The aspiring artist performed in California, Texas, and Hawaii. She settled in Hawaii and created a band named Swingshift who performed at various venues the styles of Rock, Pop, Jazz & Blues. Spagetti Dinner, yum yum- Vietnam Veterans Assn. Chapter 1031 has seized the opportunity to be the 1st group to test out our new kitchen. A spagetti feed with salad, garic bread & dessert is yours for only $5 adults and $2.50 children under 10. Better yet, it is FREE if you are a veteran and can produce your DD214 or an ID card. Jan 31, 5-8 pm.
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